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Amps showing up on display while welding

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Re: Amps showing up on display while welding

Postby PeteM » Thu Jul 27, 2017 10:25 pm

Those beads on the right side of the triangle are looking pretty decent.
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Re: Amps showing up on display while welding

Postby olek » Fri Jul 28, 2017 2:37 am

PeteM wrote:Those beads on the right side of the triangle are looking pretty decent.



Thank you for taking time to look at them.

I begun with DCEN and had some sticking while raising amps from 80 up to 95A. Those sticks. want a lot of energy to do their thing. So with EN they will need a little dig function to avoid using too high amperage. (on thin steel >
Doing regulation on the final plate is risky

I then changed to DCEP, zero dig but 90A I even tested 95. Slag peel easily it help
I even left slag in place and weld on it the next bead, once or twice as I felt I had enough energy to melt the under slag.

I suppose not recommended to do so. It did not cause trouble apparently.

Regards

Btw I did cut with a grinder and cutting disk. Then find it difficult to see the bead, the haz, I finally saw them but with very low contrast (difficult to make pics with my smartphone) . Is not the cutting disk heating much the metal ?
I did file with the angle grinder , a lot . (then used 5% nitric acid in isopropyl alcool)
I ask because I was said one need to file about 1mm thickness on a water refreshed stone \wheel so to get rid of the haz of the initial cutting. hence my precedent inquiry, are the fixed cutters (metal disk) heating less ? what tool(s) to cut and etch ?

Image
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Dedicated to learn stick welding since april
slowly learning ;) not complaining of doing beads and beads

pro inverter PROGYS 200 FV PFC CEL+tig lift & end of arc regulation
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Re: Amps showing up on display while welding

Postby olek » Fri Jul 28, 2017 8:13 am

PeteM wrote:
olek wrote:"I think " means "I have noticed that, but I am not so sure"


In my opinion, penetration and its importance is vastly overstated in welding, especially at the amateur level. The mixture ratio for filler metal to base is ideally a 70/30 mix. Therefore on a 1/8 inch weld, the penetration and mixture only needs to be approximately 1/3 the thickness of the bead size, or 1/24 of an inch of actual penetration into the base metal.

Best way to check that is a cut/polish/etch analysis, and for actual soundness of the weld- beat it till it breaks.

Fusion (or lack thereof) and the re-crystallization of the metal is the real key to a good weld.

Something to think about- Take a scribe and scratch a line down a piece of metal. Now ask yourself what amount of metal is holding one side of that scratch to the other?



Do you mean that the mix quality (amount percentage and heat,) could be more important than pure penetration?
Pianos , restorer and tuner (technician)
Dedicated to learn stick welding since april
slowly learning ;) not complaining of doing beads and beads

pro inverter PROGYS 200 FV PFC CEL+tig lift & end of arc regulation
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Re: Amps showing up on display while welding

Postby PeteM » Fri Jul 28, 2017 10:20 am

olek wrote:
PeteM wrote:
olek wrote:"I think " means "I have noticed that, but I am not so sure"


In my opinion, penetration and its importance is vastly overstated in welding, especially at the amateur level. The mixture ratio for filler metal to base is ideally a 70/30 mix. Therefore on a 1/8 inch weld, the penetration and mixture only needs to be approximately 1/3 the thickness of the bead size, or 1/24 of an inch of actual penetration into the base metal.

Best way to check that is a cut/polish/etch analysis, and for actual soundness of the weld- beat it till it breaks.

Fusion (or lack thereof) and the re-crystallization of the metal is the real key to a good weld.

Something to think about- Take a scribe and scratch a line down a piece of metal. Now ask yourself what amount of metal is holding one side of that scratch to the other?



Do you mean that the mix quality (amount percentage and heat,) could be more important than pure penetration?


Yes. The actual composition and structure of the weld is more important than penetration. The term "penetration" and what is seen in a cross section of a weld is actually just a function of the heat, but the nugget, its composition, and the structure of the mixture of the base metal and filler is what actually holds pieces together.
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Re: Amps showing up on display while welding

Postby olek » Fri Jul 28, 2017 12:58 pm

Great answers lately. I have some food to though.

How does that look? (angle up 3/32 7018)

https://photos.app.goo.gl/HTXg03NVGEFgH7Xh1


Regards
Pianos , restorer and tuner (technician)
Dedicated to learn stick welding since april
slowly learning ;) not complaining of doing beads and beads

pro inverter PROGYS 200 FV PFC CEL+tig lift & end of arc regulation
olek
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Re: Amps showing up on display while welding

Postby PeteM » Fri Jul 28, 2017 1:35 pm

A little rough, actually. I'd drop any thoughts of manipulations or swirling, and focus on arc placement. Point the electrode at the base metal about the thickness of the electrode above the previously deposited weld, pause for a moment, then move quickly across the weld to the other side to deposit again. Keep a tight Z motion upward through the weld. That is what some call "sticking the sides". Like sticking the landing in gymnastics.

If you point it into the corner between the base metal and previous weld it gets that humpy lump and creates a crevice that is prone to slag inclusion and lack of fusion.

That should smooth out the face of the weld as you become attuned to the burn off rate at a given current.
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Re: Amps showing up on display while welding

Postby Poland308 » Fri Jul 28, 2017 2:03 pm

Many of the pics you've posted lately are looking better. But they all look like you need to slow down. Bond weave so fast or so far. Hold just a little longer at the edges and let them fill in.
I have more questions than answers

Josh
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Re: Amps showing up on display while welding

Postby olek » Fri Jul 28, 2017 2:18 pm

Thank you for your comments and advice.

Yes, particularly with 7018, I begin in the high range of amps then lower till I have a nice arc and the slag is not burned
But sure it push me to move fast, yet too fast generally, I agree.

On the 3f I purposely
wanted to make the "Christmas tree" or "triangle" manipulation.

Image

Some French welders told me that 'triangle' progression is preferred. It should not make big drops, (but it fall indeed) just sort of triangular shapes one on the other (but you may know that method I am sure)

Mounting the beads from the sides, making a small inverted smile or a smile,or Z, I need more training but I understood the principle. (I may leave the triangle for later probably ;)
I will train again with arc placement in mind . . Is it better to move the rod from the wrist, or to keep the same "in front" orientation (the rod is burning more angled at the sides then)

I added 3 times on the same angle with 3/32 it can be seen in the last pictures I paused long on each side (ladder style) but there is not enough in the middle a 1/8 rod may have do the job better

I will keep in mind arc placement. I just begin to feel free to move the rod angle back and forth until I see the arc and the puddle have a wanted shape, and also I push myself to take some distance, to see from a little farther.

I am happy without arc force that I do not stick too often 7018. The start is not yet mastered (and many explanations tell not to weld immediately because of the graphite extremity, that I don't know how to deal and I have porosity at the start very often with new rods.)

Really most if the time I miss correct sight, I believe I am in the corner while I am on the tight side for instance.

I hope the number 10 golden glass will help (does it lake a green filter, it seem to be the case)
https://youtu.be/FfBFbQC7obk

Thank you again for your time and useful advices
I imagine it is not easy, from pics...

Best regards
Pianos , restorer and tuner (technician)
Dedicated to learn stick welding since april
slowly learning ;) not complaining of doing beads and beads

pro inverter PROGYS 200 FV PFC CEL+tig lift & end of arc regulation
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Re: Amps showing up on display while welding

Postby PeteM » Fri Jul 28, 2017 5:42 pm

Turn your hand back and forth while holding the stinger, don't wave your wrist like a windshield wiper.

Lift your whole wrist/arm up as you move through the weld to keep your stick angle good and prevent reaching with the electrode. That will help avoid long arcing and porosity.

And yeah, those gold lenses at #10 din will be like a whole different ball game for seeing what is happening. Will likely be a significant improvement.
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Re: Amps showing up on display while welding

Postby DFrick93 » Fri Jul 28, 2017 6:59 pm

Boy, i would think that the weld with E7018 would pass 3G,I have welded for years and a cwi,Heat is very important,AMPs So good advice,Any helpi can give Reach out!!!
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