Tig welding tips, questions, equipment, applications, instructions, techniques, tig welding machines, troubleshooting tig welding process
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CaseyCat89 wrote:
zank wrote:Did you change argon cylinders?
Yeah, I used a different machine with a different tank of argon with the same result. The funny thing is, my instructor welded the other day on the same joint to look at my issue, and while his bead was laid in the joint correctly, it was also excessively grey and kinda hard to get the puddle to flow, and he was kinda stumped.

So one idea I'm going to try tomorrow is using a different filler from a different manufacturer because the last time I was welding without any issues I was using 4043 made by a different company. the school recently switched to a different company and it is cheaper. Could a poor quality filler be the issue also?
It's entirely possible to get "moist" gas. If this is the case, the problem will grow worse as the bottle pressure drops.
The bottle filler is supposed to pull a vacuum on each bottle to draw out moisture. It's common for this step to be skipped for the sake of production. In theory, this shouldn't be a problem. In practice, completely empty bottles sit outside with the valve open because people are lazy and don't know better. A week like this waiting for pick-up, with temperature swings of 20+ degrees between night and day, and the bottles "breath", picking up atmosphere (N2, O2, CO2, and H20). If they aren't evacuated before filled, you get shitty gas in that bottle.

Most reputable welding supply services will analyze your bottle(s) if you complain. Several bottles the same way are quite possible, because the company that didn't care or know may have turned in several bottles left open, which get filled at the same time, and possibly shipped out together.

Steve S
CaseyCat89
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Otto Nobedder wrote:
CaseyCat89 wrote:
zank wrote:Did you change argon cylinders?
Yeah, I used a different machine with a different tank of argon with the same result. The funny thing is, my instructor welded the other day on the same joint to look at my issue, and while his bead was laid in the joint correctly, it was also excessively grey and kinda hard to get the puddle to flow, and he was kinda stumped.

So one idea I'm going to try tomorrow is using a different filler from a different manufacturer because the last time I was welding without any issues I was using 4043 made by a different company. the school recently switched to a different company and it is cheaper. Could a poor quality filler be the issue also?
It's entirely possible to get "moist" gas. If this is the case, the problem will grow worse as the bottle pressure drops.
The bottle filler is supposed to pull a vacuum on each bottle to draw out moisture. It's common for this step to be skipped for the sake of production. In theory, this shouldn't be a problem. In practice, completely empty bottles sit outside with the valve open because people are lazy and don't know better. A week like this waiting for pick-up, with temperature swings of 20+ degrees between night and day, and the bottles "breath", picking up atmosphere (N2, O2, CO2, and H20). If they aren't evacuated before filled, you get shitty gas in that bottle.

Most reputable welding supply services will analyze your bottle(s) if you complain. Several bottles the same way are quite possible, because the company that didn't care or know may have turned in several bottles left open, which get filled at the same time, and possibly shipped out together.

Steve S
Thanks Steve, I could see this being a problem too. The tank of gas hadn't given me any problems at the start but it should be running low now (the tank reg doesn't work...surprise) and I'm not sure how much is left in the tank. Thanks for your post!
CaseyCat89
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So, I still didn't figure out the problem completely, but I believe it's filler and/or gas related. I bought new filler from a more reputable place, cleaned the aluminum with aluminum cleaner for welding and a new stainless brush, cleaned the filler, and the 4043 still turned out looking just as bad. The rod stuck to the aluminum multiple times and the puddle was hard to control. It favored the bottom plate, and the tungsten started to turn slightly gray/white like there was a little aluminum on it or something. I could see the Sandy appearance on the bead also. When I welded with 5356 however, using the same prep, it turned out fine, albiet wobbly, and the tungsten stayed cleaner.

5356 on the left, 4043 on the right. The 4043 I had to stop and start a couple times due to the bead not running right
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Farmwelding
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All the aluminum I've welded is 6061 with 4043 filler and never a problem. That is interesting. If it is sticking to the plate like you are saying you have to keep the rod off the plate. I do it a lot when running aluminum get lazy rest it on the plate and then it won't move and then got to stop or run ahead real quick to quick melt it.
A student now but really want to weld everyday. Want to learn everything about everything. Want to become a knower of all and master of none.
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Nick
CaseyCat89
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Farmwelding wrote:All the aluminum I've welded is 6061 with 4043 filler and never a problem. That is interesting. If it is sticking to the plate like you are saying you have to keep the rod off the plate. I do it a lot when running aluminum get lazy rest it on the plate and then it won't move and then got to stop or run ahead real quick to quick melt it.
Yeah i will say my shaky hands today don't help much. The real issue seemed to be every time I touched the filler to the puddle edge it would want to stick. I'll talk to my instructor again about this now that I can compare a different filler.

It's weird to me too because I was just using 4043 to weld all my joints as of 4 weeks ago. This started happening recently.
cj737
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4043 turns pretty "rainy" due to the accumulated heat. 5356 not so. Stays shinier.

I never rest my filler wire on the metal with aluminum because the metal gets too dang hot and your wire will stick. Gravity and arc angle will cause your aluminum puddle to favor the lower side. Add your filler to the high side, and keep your arc pointed at the joint. That way you will get enough filler above the seam.
exnailpounder
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Turn up your balance more into the penetration side. Takes out all the grainy appearance and you will have nice shiny beads. Your machine has a recommended balance setting, go a couple numbers into pen side...just a little bit...it does wonders.
Ifyoucantellmewhatthissaysiwillbuyyouabeer.
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