Nope, don’t really plan building my own. Too much work to make it good and pretty.
But from china one can but tig cooler (fan only) or laser tube chiller (refrigerant heat pump, temp controller included) for roughly the same price.
So, IF the laser tube chiller has enough pump pressure for a tig torch and the temp can be controller to the water running through the torch is not too cold, then I would get the laser tube chiller. And in the future I can also run a laser cutter on the same water chiller unit.
BTW: I made a typo with the refrigerant. I meant r134a. Same stuff that goes into split AC units
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TraditionalToolworks
- TraditionalToolworks
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Weldmonger
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Joined:Mon Dec 18, 2017 7:49 am
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Location:San Jose / Kelseyville
I absolutely agree with you, although I do like making stuff, the good and pretty part is typically more work.DLF wrote:Nope, don’t really plan building my own. Too much work to make it good and pretty.
In this same regard why I, and presumably Spartan from his comments, find the HTP cooler to have some leg up on the Chinese units. I'm not certain it's better, but HTP is known for their quality.
No worries on the refrigerant, I only vaguely remember the numbers, I'm not a very good wrench when it comes to working on cars...
In regard to a cooler, it seems about US $800 is about what it would take since coolant and a new torch needs to be purchased in order to take advantage of the cooler as well. Might be higher for you if you're outside the US. That seems like a decent advantage in order to get up to 250 amps with a small torch.
Collector of old Iron!
Alan
Alan
Just like in your car engine, the coolant will break down and begin to ionize with the metal Parts containing it, so it is best they say to replace it once a year. Miller recommends exactly that and they also say not to use stale coolant off the shelf. The last time I talked to them I mentioned that I had a case of coolant and they said don't use it because it's too old. If it were not for what I know about Automotive cooling systems I would have said that was BS but the fact is, they are probably right.
I get what you're saying, but it's just not that critical for me, especially considering that it is such a simple closed-loop system. And personally, I don't put a lot of stock in the change frequency recommendations of the companies that are selling the coolant for $35/gallon (my coolers take 2 gallons each).BugHunter wrote:Just like in your car engine, the coolant will break down and begin to ionize with the metal Parts containing it, so it is best they say to replace it once a year. Miller recommends exactly that and they also say not to use stale coolant off the shelf. The last time I talked to them I mentioned that I had a case of coolant and they said don't use it because it's too old. If it were not for what I know about Automotive cooling systems I would have said that was BS but the fact is, they are probably right.
I accept the risk. But like I said, I do keep an eye on it.
TraditionalToolworks
- TraditionalToolworks
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Weldmonger
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Joined:Mon Dec 18, 2017 7:49 am
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Location:San Jose / Kelseyville
I don't know the exact details but HTP coolers that have not had the coolant replaced and some of the connectors or sensors getting oxidized cause the alarm to go off. You would need to check the WeldingWeb forum for the HTP, seems there was someone that had this issue just about 2-3 months ago, maybe not that long.Spartan wrote:I get what you're saying, but it's just not that critical for me, especially considering that it is such a simple closed-loop system.
No worries here, I don't even have a cooler!Spartan wrote:I accept the risk. But like I said, I do keep an eye on it.
Just so you don't need to search and dig around:
https://weldingweb.com/vbb/showthread.p ... LOW-ALARM-!!
Collector of old Iron!
Alan
Alan
Interesting thread. Thanks for sharing that. I about face-palmed when the fellow was talking about removing the bypass to fix his flow problem!TraditionalToolworks wrote:I don't know the exact details but HTP coolers that have not had the coolant replaced and some of the connectors or sensors getting oxidized cause the alarm to go off. You would need to check the WeldingWeb forum for the HTP, seems there was someone that had this issue just about 2-3 months ago, maybe not that long.Spartan wrote:I get what you're saying, but it's just not that critical for me, especially considering that it is such a simple closed-loop system.
No worries here, I don't even have a cooler!Spartan wrote:I accept the risk. But like I said, I do keep an eye on it.
Just so you don't need to search and dig around:
https://weldingweb.com/vbb/showthread.p ... LOW-ALARM-!!
Shawn_Laughlin
- Shawn_Laughlin
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New Member
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Joined:Fri Apr 08, 2022 11:59 pm
I know this is an old topic but I want to add something bc I have some experience with this. all the conversations I’ve seen on this topic I haven’t seen anyone give any real backed up info so I’ll give you what I’ve found so far.
Okay I’ll start off by saying it’s not a terrible idea. The condensation I’ve heard people speak about is absolutely false. People think refrigerant and they think how cold your ac blows but don’t think about how much heat is brought back to the tank from the Torch that the condensor has to deal with.
You see in your house or car the evap has air blowing over it and that in turn you feel the cold air but when that same evap is submerged in a liquid, warm to hot liquid mind you, it acts like a reverse heat sink and the efficiency to cool the surrounding area,the coolant vs air goes way down. When your liquid comes out of your cap tube and expands in the evap it gets cold when it leaves the evap through the suction of the compressor the line is cold and that helps keep your compressor temp in check along with the condensor fan. I’m sure everyone has felt the cold line coming down out of your house to the outside unit. That’s your low side and your low side should be cold. If it’s hot then there is a problem somewhere.
Well since it’s surrounded by warm or hot water you don’t get that cooling effect and the compressor will get hot faster so you can throw the thermostat in the garbage bc your coolant will never get cold enough to work with a thermostat unless something special was used. The way I’ve gotten away with it was to install a timer relay that does cyclic on offs in 20 minute intervals. That’s a bit much or way too much but mine hasn’t failed me yet but I’m sure will now that I said that.
Now with that said when welding in dc it is no big deal but when you get into ac and welding aluminum,especially thicker aluminum and 200 to 300 amps it will definitely over power the evap and I have to let it cool down. Bc no matter how many times it cycles it’s not going to catch up and the compressor will end up overheating.
I’ve been thinking about building another one or fitting a bigger compressor and upping the condensor and evap coils a few sizes up.
That will increase the cooling capacity but will also decrease the amount of coolant in my tank bc the bigger tubing will take up more area inside the tank. I wanted this to work bad and it sounded like a genius idea and thought it would be a piece of cake but cake it was not.
If anything, I can say I learned a lot about hvac but god knows not nearly enough. But hey that’s what it’s all about, living and learning.
So that’s some of what I’ve learned while doing this and I just hope someone finds this helpful.
Okay I’ll start off by saying it’s not a terrible idea. The condensation I’ve heard people speak about is absolutely false. People think refrigerant and they think how cold your ac blows but don’t think about how much heat is brought back to the tank from the Torch that the condensor has to deal with.
You see in your house or car the evap has air blowing over it and that in turn you feel the cold air but when that same evap is submerged in a liquid, warm to hot liquid mind you, it acts like a reverse heat sink and the efficiency to cool the surrounding area,the coolant vs air goes way down. When your liquid comes out of your cap tube and expands in the evap it gets cold when it leaves the evap through the suction of the compressor the line is cold and that helps keep your compressor temp in check along with the condensor fan. I’m sure everyone has felt the cold line coming down out of your house to the outside unit. That’s your low side and your low side should be cold. If it’s hot then there is a problem somewhere.
Well since it’s surrounded by warm or hot water you don’t get that cooling effect and the compressor will get hot faster so you can throw the thermostat in the garbage bc your coolant will never get cold enough to work with a thermostat unless something special was used. The way I’ve gotten away with it was to install a timer relay that does cyclic on offs in 20 minute intervals. That’s a bit much or way too much but mine hasn’t failed me yet but I’m sure will now that I said that.
Now with that said when welding in dc it is no big deal but when you get into ac and welding aluminum,especially thicker aluminum and 200 to 300 amps it will definitely over power the evap and I have to let it cool down. Bc no matter how many times it cycles it’s not going to catch up and the compressor will end up overheating.
I’ve been thinking about building another one or fitting a bigger compressor and upping the condensor and evap coils a few sizes up.
That will increase the cooling capacity but will also decrease the amount of coolant in my tank bc the bigger tubing will take up more area inside the tank. I wanted this to work bad and it sounded like a genius idea and thought it would be a piece of cake but cake it was not.
If anything, I can say I learned a lot about hvac but god knows not nearly enough. But hey that’s what it’s all about, living and learning.
So that’s some of what I’ve learned while doing this and I just hope someone finds this helpful.