Tig welding tips, questions, equipment, applications, instructions, techniques, tig welding machines, troubleshooting tig welding process
ESENTI
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Steve , It says mostly , it can bu used in either way by a welder manualy or automation , and the machine does it itself I canot see how you can do it in a machine that has not been desined for this .Switching ac to dc is imposible while you work on an aluminum it remains only theoritcal aproach at the moment ...
I dont know this model and in my area is very rare to see MIller Machines,(Europe ) even that i know that it is represented it in Italy ..
but i know that are very good machines ...I have Fronius magic wave 220 ...Which is i think even better ...

Esenti
BDoubleU

I'm jumping in a little late on this discussion ... but wanted to share a pic of some DCEN w/ helium on aluminum. Originally, TIG was trade-named HELIARC because the process used DCEN w/ 100% helium. But, today AC is the most common and preferred method for most applications ... it produces good results and argon is cheaper than helium. But, the application in this photo would not allow for any surface "etching" caused by an AC arc ... so it was welded with a Miller Aerowave in DCEN. The edges of the weld look a little smokey - but otherwise they turned out pretty sweet.
Brent Williams Aluminum DCEN with Helium.JPG
Brent Williams Aluminum DCEN with Helium.JPG (25.37 KiB) Viewed 4491 times
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That's slick, Brent!

I have access to all the (high-purity) helium I can use, and have yet to have an excuse to try this. It's coming...

I have used He/Ar, at aprox. 50/50 on HFAC aluminum for thick sections, and the difference is impressive!

Steve S
RedIron881
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Telling yeah it works great if the settings and the hands are there. Plus, it's nice and quiet, ha ha! Thanks for sharing Brent.
kiwi2wheels
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Any doubts about the quality of aluminum welds done with DC and helium should be forgotten. Short runs, peen and allow to cool, repeat.

All Rodeck top fuel dragster blocks and heads are repaired with DC. Also many historic auto race engine blocks, e.g., DFV Cosworths

Pioneered, or perfected, I believe by ; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epperly
zigeuner
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New poster here. Thought I would start somewhere. I recall many years ago when I was working as a rocket engine mechanic and assembler at Rocketdyne in Los Angeles California, I marveled at the lovely welds done on the alumnum liquid oxygen ductings and also on the stainless steel ductings used for the engine fuel.

In time, I got to know most of the weldors in the plant and I was often permttted to observe the welding being done. As I recall, all of the welding on both aluminum and stainless steel parts was done with DC and helium. Additionally, all of the machines being used were straight transformer units and were quite large and powerful. This was when the process was called Heliarc. This was also long before the common use of digital equipment capable of producing square waves superimposed on AC power. It spoke highly of the skill of the weldors using what equipment was available at that time (late 1950's) All of the welds were X-rayed and stamped by an inspector as well.

It helped of course, that the company had sources for their high pressure cylinder gases, in particular helium. At that time, cost wasn't that much of an issue, I guess. While it's perfectly clear that excellent welds can be done providing stacks of dimes, nickels, and quarters, LOL, the cost of helium and the fact that a larger machine is needed would make DC with helium prohibitive for a hobby weldor such as myself. I have a Miller Syncrowave 200 that serves my needs very well with Argon gas. With Argon currently costing me something like $70 for a 160 c.f. customer-owned cylinder exchange, I can't even imagine what helium might cost. I really don't know because I have never tried DC with helium. Nonetheless, it's certainly possible on aluminum.
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Hey
Welcome to the forum. I liked your little slice of history. Keep it coming.

Mick
Nils
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I thought I would contribute to this thread's longevity by adding a penny to it. DCEN for welding aluminum? Why not? If the surface is prepped sufficiently and a greater amount of oxidation is removed, then there is no need for cathotic etching. Deep penetration and a clean bead all at the same time. BTW, in the picture above, provided by bdoublew, the torch angle looks a little bit much. What do you think? Long live the thread!
Everlast PowerTig 250EX, PowerTig 185 Micro, PowerArc 160STH, Miller Trailblazer 301G, Millermatic 140 Auto-Set
zigeuner
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weldin mike 27 wrote:Hey
Welcome to the forum. I liked your little slice of history. Keep it coming.

Mick

Thanks Mate! I'm always pleased to hear from folks in Australia. I have many Internet friends and associates in the motorcycling and machining world from OZ.

Regards, from Sunny California. :)
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Pleasure mate, One of my dreams in life isnto get over to Southern California to check out Tehachapi and Cajon passes. (rail fan post hijack) :? :?
BDoubleU

Nils wrote:BTW, in the picture above, provided by bdoublew, the torch angle looks a little bit much. What do you think? Long live the thread!
Yes, I think the pic was taken during post flow ...
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RedIron881
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DC root pass on .750 to .750 beveled butt weld on good old 6061 Aluminum.
Optimized-IMG_0294.jpg
Optimized-IMG_0294.jpg (74.04 KiB) Viewed 3528 times
After wire brushed and acetone wipe for cover pass
Optimized-IMG_0851.jpg
Optimized-IMG_0851.jpg (83.08 KiB) Viewed 3528 times
Full length root pass.
IMG_7047.jpg
IMG_7047.jpg (75.42 KiB) Viewed 3528 times
desert_warrior
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Hi all: I am new here, and very interested in purchasing a TIG welder for home/projects/etc. There are not a lot of
options at the low end, which are decent quality (I am trying to avoid cheap Chinese machines), so I was considering
a DC TIG/Plasma combo. Then I found this thread; very interesting as perhaps I can get away with a lower priced
DC only TIG welder. The tips sound interesting as an option for someone who will not weld aluminium very often. Any
further feedback is welcome. Cheers.

Jose aka Desert Warrior
ironmanjay
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Good to see this DC aluminum talk. I only now have a Everlast PA 160STH and I was told that I could not weld aluminum. Well that is a bad thing since one of my projects was going to be a flat boat. Let me ask, if you have a AC stick can you weld aluminum with those after market TIG rigs?
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Hey,

I wondered that myself, but I have come to the conclusion that AC without high freq stabilisation will not work. Hence Jody's video with the AC buzz box hooked up to a rectifier to convert it back to DC. This may be crap, somebody out there will correct me if im wrong.

Mick
BDoubleU

Just to clarify a few things ... AC Tig with Argon is still the preferred way & typically what's recommended in the industry. As Welders, we just don't like to be told something "can't be done" ... So it's good conversation to tell stories about welding aluminum with DC & helium. Just keep in mind that most people use AC because it's more consistent & user friendly. In addition, helium is expensive & introduces other issues to the process ...

Keep in mind that Helium runs at a much higher arc voltage than argon & not all machines will perform with it. Some newer units monitor arc voltage & will shut down if the voltage is too high. You also need to run 2x the flow rate of argon & remember that helium floats away, while argon settles & is heavier than air. In addition, be prepared for poor arc starts ... As helium doesn't carry the arc as well as Argon either. It's also very tough to add filler with a DC arc on aluminum ... So the bead doesn't always look like a stack of dimes.

AC buzz boxes have trouble with aluminum Tig because the arc goes out every 1/2 cycle. Chances are, the arc may only ignite every other cycle - called rectification. That's why they didn't use old AC sine wave machines for aluminum until they figured out High Frequency ... Which keeps the arc lit. Now, square wave technology has improved it ... But even the most advanced inverters on the market struggle with arc outages & continue to use HF or a high voltage in the process.

It can be done ... But I wouldn't recommend buying a DC unit to weld aluminum or adapting an AC buzz box ... Unless you absolutely have no choice or are very familiar with the process (ie: expert, trained, etc). ;)

Happy welding ...
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RedIron881 wrote:DC root pass on .750 to .750 beveled butt weld on good old 6061 Aluminum.
Optimized-IMG_0294.jpg
After wire brushed and acetone wipe for cover pass
Optimized-IMG_0851.jpg
Full length root pass.
IMG_7047.jpg
Roy,

Thanks for your posts on Welding aluminum on DC. I think they are about the best info out there on the web...and the photos speak volumes about what can be done.

I did a simple repair a week or so ago on an aluminum shaft that was accidentally gouged by the tool changer on a cnc lathe It didnt look too pretty because the gash was about 3/4" deep and about an inch long so not enough space to really get going to stack dimes....the repair went much better than it would have using AC and it machined off clean.

Are you using standard welding grade helium or UHP (ultra high purity)

And BTW , I do remember meeting you and your gal at sun n fun in lakeland.

jody
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admin wrote:
RedIron881 wrote:DC root pass on .750 to .750 beveled butt weld on good old 6061 Aluminum.
Optimized-IMG_0294.jpg
After wire brushed and acetone wipe for cover pass
Optimized-IMG_0851.jpg
Full length root pass.
IMG_7047.jpg
Roy,

Thanks for your posts on Welding aluminum on DC. I think they are about the best info out there on the web...and the photos speak volumes about what can be done.

I did a simple repair a week or so ago on an aluminum shaft that was accidentally gouged by the tool changer on a cnc lathe It didnt look too pretty because the gash was about 3/4" deep and about an inch long so not enough space to really get going to stack dimes....the repair went much better than it would have using AC and it machined off clean.

Are you using standard welding grade helium or UHP (ultra high purity)

And BTW , I do remember meeting you and your gal at sun n fun in lakeland.

jody
Sun and Fun? The EAA gathering?

Steve S
RedIron881
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Judy,

I'm glad to see that this posting has gone around a lot with pushing 6,000 views! I know a lot of weldors out there still disagree but that's inevitable and that's okay. It's a handy tool to have in the toolbox. Glad it worked for you as it has for me many times. As for the Helium I've been using just normal welding grade He. I've used UHP cause the cert called it out, but didn't really notice much difference except the price.

It was nice meeting you at Sun 'n Fun (airshow). Surprised you still remember, ha ha! Since then, I've moved back to Florida and about to buy a house with my gal. Looking forward to get a little side weld shop going in the garage sometime soon!

Keep the videos coming. We enjoy them all.

Roy
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"Judy"???

LOL!

I'm thrilled I'm not the only one here who knows what "Sun 'n Fun" is...

Steve S
TamJeff
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Otto Nobedder wrote:"Judy"???

LOL!

I'm thrilled I'm not the only one here who knows what "Sun 'n Fun" is...

Steve S
My fishing buddy, yet another Steve, used to run air traffic for sun n fun.
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gta18
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Guys, I have a harborfreight dc tig machine. I know I tried at one time to tig aluminum but I only have argon, I remember that I only got like a hole on the uncleaned plate I tried to weld.


does anyone know or have tried using straight argon with dc?

What would be the disadvantage or is it even possible with argon?

Thanks!
Littlecub
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The Saturn 5 rocket was welded D C. 7.5 MILLION H.P. I welded engine actuator arms, aluminum tubing about 5 or 6 in. O D x 3/4 wall. Back in 1964.
GreinTime
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Edit: forgot to read the previous 6 pages, and didn't realize what he was asking until I did... my bad!

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#oneleggedproblems
-=Sam=-
noddybrian
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@ Littlecub.

Welcome to the forum - now that's way cool to have worked on something like that - you'll make "Otto" jealous - coz in his words he's not a rocket scientist ( just plays with liquid hydrogen ! )did you do much work on the rocket or was this a one off part maybe for an outside contractor ? never heard much about the production of the Saturns - despite their significance in history - it's always the shuttle that gets the glory.
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