Re: Beer Can Welding Challenge
Posted: Wed Nov 16, 2016 1:04 pm
parlor trick is exactly how I was thinking of it. I'm gonna try grinding the tungsten at a broader angle and blunting as Dmitry suggests too.
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https://forum.weldingtipsandtricks.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=10442
Thanks, I'm going to give that a shot. I can weld normal aluminium plate down to .6mm no problems and have never, ever had arc focus/stability problems before.BigD wrote:Try blunting it. I was recently practicing welding 1mm aluminum to build a big box out of it and I had a bear of a time getting the arc to focus. I recently did a bunch of thick steel and I was used to using a pencil sharpened electrode. It instinctively feels like it should pinpoint the arc but it does the exact opposite. I blunted the electrode to a very shallow point, like maybe 30-45 degrees, and the arc instantly became focused and stable.MosquitoMoto wrote:I have a sharp electrode... The arc wander almost seems like bad earth
Well, it's not a universal welding challenge for no reason, there are a bunch of things at play which make it difficult (crappy metal, drastically varying thickness, welding in a valley, various (often alcoholic) outgassing...MosquitoMoto wrote:Thanks, I'm going to give that a shot. I can weld normal aluminium plate down to .6mm no problems and have never, ever had arc focus/stability problems before.BigD wrote:Try blunting it. I was recently practicing welding 1mm aluminum to build a big box out of it and I had a bear of a time getting the arc to focus. I recently did a bunch of thick steel and I was used to using a pencil sharpened electrode. It instinctively feels like it should pinpoint the arc but it does the exact opposite. I blunted the electrode to a very shallow point, like maybe 30-45 degrees, and the arc instantly became focused and stable.MosquitoMoto wrote:I have a sharp electrode... The arc wander almost seems like bad earth
Funny, isn't it? I built a little decorative steel side table from scratch last weekend and it was a complete success, yet somehow not being able to weld cans together really gets to me! I am an odd man.
Kym
If you search, someone posted a picture of arc cones in relation to tungsten grinding angles. A sharp tungsten promoted a soft arc start, but the arc cone is wide. A flat tungsten has an almost straight arc the width of the tungsten. It just likes to walk around until it decides to do what it wants, as there is no "guide" to direct it where you want it to go.BigD wrote:Try blunting it. I was recently practicing welding 1mm aluminum to build a big box out of it and I had a bear of a time getting the arc to focus. I recently did a bunch of thick steel and I was used to using a pencil sharpened electrode. It instinctively feels like it should pinpoint the arc but it does the exact opposite. I blunted the electrode to a very shallow point, like maybe 30-45 degrees, and the arc instantly became focused and stable.MosquitoMoto wrote:I have a sharp electrode... The arc wander almost seems like bad earth
GreinTime wrote:If you search, someone posted a picture of arc cones in relation to tungsten grinding angles. A sharp tungsten promoted a soft arc start, but the arc cone is wide. A flat tungsten has an almost straight arc the width of the tungsten. It just likes to walk around until it decides to do what it wants, as there is no "guide" to direct it where you want it to go.BigD wrote:Try blunting it. I was recently practicing welding 1mm aluminum to build a big box out of it and I had a bear of a time getting the arc to focus. I recently did a bunch of thick steel and I was used to using a pencil sharpened electrode. It instinctively feels like it should pinpoint the arc but it does the exact opposite. I blunted the electrode to a very shallow point, like maybe 30-45 degrees, and the arc instantly became focused and stable.MosquitoMoto wrote:I have a sharp electrode... The arc wander almost seems like bad earth
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Yeah right!MosquitoMoto wrote:GreinTime wrote:If you search, someone posted a picture of arc cones in relation to tungsten grinding angles. A sharp tungsten promoted a soft arc start, but the arc cone is wide. A flat tungsten has an almost straight arc the width of the tungsten. It just likes to walk around until it decides to do what it wants, as there is no "guide" to direct it where you want it to go.BigD wrote: Try blunting it. I was recently practicing welding 1mm aluminum to build a big box out of it and I had a bear of a time getting the arc to focus. I recently did a bunch of thick steel and I was used to using a pencil sharpened electrode. It instinctively feels like it should pinpoint the arc but it does the exact opposite. I blunted the electrode to a very shallow point, like maybe 30-45 degrees, and the arc instantly became focused and stable.
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Cheers, yep, saw that, I think it was Oscar who posted it.
Experimentation with various grinds coming next. Actually making a jog to hold the cans, too!
Then when I've finished I'm going to get a life. Honest!
Kym
So I'm not the only nerd thinking about fixturing for can welding? I don't think I can afford a life, takes too much time and money away from having fun.MosquitoMoto wrote: Actually making a jig to hold the cans, too!
Kym
Whatever. If you're teaching a little girl how to tig then you've already got a pretty good one.MosquitoMoto wrote:
Then when I've finished I'm going to get a life. Honest!
Kym
How about the crack of...dawnexnailpounder wrote:Nice work maker! We are running out of challenges. Time to think up something new.
You firstLtBadd wrote:How about the crack of...dawnexnailpounder wrote:Nice work maker! We are running out of challenges. Time to think up something new.
Well you could try to weld the tab back on!exnailpounder wrote:Nice work maker! We are running out of challenges. Time to think up something new.
You gotta up your amps and turn down your gas. You have to force the arc to stay in place.. Using a real steep torch angle helps alot too. I use about 75 amps for this trick. You would think it would just melt the cans but it doesn't. Light up on your filler rod.Jakedaawg wrote:Although I am just learning, I decided to try this beer can challenge out. Having an issue with Arc wandering and stuff. I did manage to get a couple of tack welds and got two cans stuck together. The Arc Wonder is prohibiting me from finishing
When You say a steep angle grind on the tungsten do you meen a lonlg fine point or a short blunt point. I tried both on a 1/16" E3. One I suppose was grinder about a 15* point so the it was like a needle but still had a little flat spot. the other I would say was more than 45* not quite a flat 1/16" tungsten but a bit of a taper with the same little flat on the end. The flat on the end of each was maybe 1/64".exnailpounder wrote:You gotta up your amps and turn down your gas. You have to force the arc to stay in place.. Using a real steep torch angle helps alot too. I use about 75 amps for this trick. You would think it would just melt the cans but it doesn't. Light up on your filler rod.Jakedaawg wrote:Although I am just learning, I decided to try this beer can challenge out. Having an issue with Arc wandering and stuff. I did manage to get a couple of tack welds and got two cans stuck together. The Arc Wonder is prohibiting me from finishing
Torch angle has to be steep. Grind your tungsten to a short point and knock the tip off. Don't worry about cleaning action because all you are doing is heating up the cans. The whole trick is to light up on your filler, get it melting and then keep feeding it into the puddle as you move forward. I use 3/32" tungsten and filler, you need thick enough rod to melt, not vaporize.. I haven't been able to make a "pretty" one yet but maybe someone better at Al than me can do it. Unless you have a welding lathe you can't weld very far without stopping so a great looking continuous weld isn't achievable.Jakedaawg wrote:When You say a steep angle grind on the tungsten do you meen a lonlg fine point or a short blunt point. I tried both on a 1/16" E3. One I suppose was grinder about a 15* point so the it was like a needle but still had a little flat spot. the other I would say was more than 45* not quite a flat 1/16" tungsten but a bit of a taper with the same little flat on the end. The flat on the end of each was maybe 1/64".exnailpounder wrote:You gotta up your amps and turn down your gas. You have to force the arc to stay in place.. Using a real steep torch angle helps alot too. I use about 75 amps for this trick. You would think it would just melt the cans but it doesn't. Light up on your filler rod.Jakedaawg wrote:Although I am just learning, I decided to try this beer can challenge out. Having an issue with Arc wandering and stuff. I did manage to get a couple of tack welds and got two cans stuck together. The Arc Wonder is prohibiting me from finishing
I was useing 40Amps foot pedal, never got to full pedal. 65% EN on a dynasty. Lit on the filler with as little pedal as possible to let some cleaning happen. Then incrrased pedal to get the filler to melt. Tri wave. Set the dynasty on .040 tungsten even though I had 1/16" tungsten on a lens with #7 cup. More than ten on the flow less than 15.
I was able to get the tacks but wasn't able to proceed. I was not blowing through I just could not get the filler to melt clean and flow.